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Thread: BJ Penn Vs Nick Diaz - UFC 137

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    BJ Penn Vs Nick Diaz - UFC 137

    Since this shit looks like it is going down, might as well start a thread for it.

    When he last spoke with MMAjunkie.com (www.mmajunkie.com), boxing promoter Don Chargin said he had contracted Nick Diaz to box Jeff Lacy in the fall and expected the fighter and his representatives to act in good faith.

    He's had a change of heart since then.

    While he's disappointed that Diaz won't be boxing anytime soon, Chargin said he'd rather step aside to let the Strikeforce champ take a fight of another kind – against Georges St-Pierre.

    "That's something he wanted with St-Pierre," Chargin said. "He wants to box, too. But what if he lost to Lacy? It would kill the [St-Pierre] fight."

    Conversations with the Diaz camp have led Chargin to believe a fight between the Diaz and St-Pierre is currently on the table for December.

    "That's what they told me," he said.

    Diaz's manager, Cesar Gracie, was unreachable for comment. UFC president Dana White wasn't – he threw cold water on the notion that the superfight is all but a done deal by telling MMAjunkie.com there are "still a lot of hurdles" to making it a reality.

    Boxing could be one of them. Diaz has a clause in his Strikeforce contract that allows him a professional boxing match in 2011. White had said he would honor the contract at the same time he expressed confidence in his ability to make a Diaz vs. St-Pierre superfight happen. He reportedly met with Diaz this past week in Las Vegas.

    So while boxing appears to be on hold, Chargin expects that Diaz will someday enter the ring – perhaps as early as next year.

    "We're still going to do something, but after this fight," Chargin said. "Let him get his chance at that title. He still wants to box. That's all they talk about."

    Whether MMA fans share Diaz's enthusiasm is another matter. In the past year, the fighter has built tremendous momentum by defending his title three times in dominant fashion. His momentum hit fever pitch this past month when he defeated Paul Daley by TKO in the first major Strikeforce event since the promotion was purchased by UFC parent company Zuffa.

    The Strikeforce champ was on the tip of many a tongue as a potential challenger to St-Pierre after a tepid response to the UFC champ's most recent title defense against Jake Shields at UFC 129.

    White has said he would not co-promote between Strikeforce and the UFC, even after buyout. If Diaz were to migrate, his current contract would likely need to be revised or replaced by one bearing Zuffa's name. That could jeopardize a move back to boxing; standard to all Zuffa contracts is a championship clause that prevents fighters from leaving the promotion in the event that a title is won.

    That's just one of the hurdles to which White likely alludes.

    For now, Chargin said he's being patient.

    "Those guys work hard enough that if he's got a chance – and the way they explained it to me, it's a heck of an opportunity," Chargin said. "I'd feel terrible if he didn't get that chance because of something in the boxing thing. If it was just a fight and not a major MMA fight, I would have tried to talk him out of it.

    "But with this, and with what people are telling me, it would be a big fight."
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    Senior Member SPX's Avatar
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    Just like with Silva, I'll believe it when I see it.

    Also, what the fuck does Diaz losing a boxing match have to do with anything in MMA?
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    Senior Member MMA_scientist's Avatar
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    I don't understand why this is a superfight. GSP is going to wreck Diaz 5 ways to Sunday. I don't think Diaz could beat Koscheck/Fitch/Story/Alves or any other contender in the UFC. I think he would look a lot like Nate does in the UFC WW division. He would get some wins, but never contend. I would rather see Nick fight Diego again or something.
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    Senior Member SPX's Avatar
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    Well it's champion vs champion of the two biggest MMA orgs in the world. So I DO think the fight needs to happen. It's a fight that makes sense. Why would Nick fight Diego? Diego's not the champ. But I do agree that GSP wins and probably fairly easily.
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    Senior Member MMA_scientist's Avatar
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    Yeah, but Nick is the champ of a bunch of scrubs. 170 in SF is weaksauce, there is no one in it. It is like saying Makovski vs. Cruz has to happen because Makovski is the champ of the 2nd biggest promotion for BWs. I just threw Diego out there because Diego beat him (and I think would beat him again). Nick has rattled off a string of wins, but he hasn't beat anyone other than Daley that could even win a fight in the UFC (and tbh, Daley only did as well as he did, because of favorable matchmaking). I mean, I am not going to be upset that it is happening, but Nick is not a real threat to GSP IMO. And I think he will be relegated to gatekeeper status again before too long. I like Diaz and I like his style of fighting, and I would love it if he beat GSP. But he isn't in the same league as GSP. He just flat out does not have the goods to beat him.
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    Senior Member edman5555's Avatar
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    I think you are probably correct. I bet we can get some good odds betting against him after he fights GSP.

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    Senior Member SPX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MMA_scientist View Post
    Yeah, but Nick is the champ of a bunch of scrubs. 170 in SF is weaksauce, there is no one in it. It is like saying Makovski vs. Cruz has to happen because Makovski is the champ of the 2nd biggest promotion for BWs. I just threw Diego out there because Diego beat him (and I think would beat him again). Nick has rattled off a string of wins, but he hasn't beat anyone other than Daley that could even win a fight in the UFC (and tbh, Daley only did as well as he did, because of favorable matchmaking). I mean, I am not going to be upset that it is happening, but Nick is not a real threat to GSP IMO. And I think he will be relegated to gatekeeper status again before too long. I like Diaz and I like his style of fighting, and I would love it if he beat GSP. But he isn't in the same league as GSP. He just flat out does not have the goods to beat him.
    I agree. I've always said that SF's welterweight division isn't shit. But I think what probably warrants a champ vs champ match more than anything is that even though Diaz has mostly just been beating mid-tier fighters, he's been doing it with relative ease. Except for maybe the Daley fight, he hasn't had many (if any) moments where he's ever really looked in trouble.

    Furthermore, except for maybe giving Fitch another shot, there aren't really any contenders right now in the UFC who are standing out as being really ready for a title shot.
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    Diaz is gonna bitch slap GSP

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    Senior Member MMA_scientist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SPX View Post
    Furthermore, except for maybe giving Fitch another shot, there aren't really any contenders right now in the UFC who are standing out as being really ready for a title shot.
    I think it is more this than anything. It is at least an interesting story line. GSP has pretty well cleaned out the division and no one else can get past Fitch/Alves/Koschek. The only way anyone is getting title shots these days is if they don't have to fight Fitch first. Koscheck got the shot is because he has immunity from Fitch via being a teammate. Penn got a shot because he was a LW. Hardy somehow didn't have to fight any contenders. Kampmann was getting close to shot, but he also didn't have to go through any one of those guys. They basically have to manufacture challengers for GSP at this point, because no one can beat Fitch, Kos or Alves (except maybe each other).

    I think Story has the best chance of actually earning a title shot of any challenger in recent times. He will be the only guy that took a legit road to a shot going through actual contenders to get there.
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    Nope, because Alves is gonna kick his ass.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thewisemann View Post
    Nope, because Alves is gonna kick his ass.
    lol. probably. I think Story has a great chance... but maybe it is just wishful thinking to lend credence to my "Hendricks will be champ theory."
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    I think Thiago is on his way to the title.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thewisemann View Post
    I think Thiago is on his way to a title shot.
    I fixed that for you.
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    Didnt need fixed. Diaz gonna beat GSP then Alves gonna fuck Diaz up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thewisemann View Post
    Didnt need fixed. Diaz gonna beat GSP then Alves gonna fuck Diaz up.
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    How are Diaz sweeps?

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    I don't think I remember seeing Diaz hit too many sweeps. He's more of a "dangerous from anywhere so sweeps aren't as necessary" type grapplers.
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    He had penty of time to work on Daley and he couldn't do shit. He has been pinned down by a bunch of guys in the past. He is only winning now because he hasn't fought a single grappler since leaving the UFC. His bjj is good, but nowhere near good enough for GSP.
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    I agree regarding Fitch and Kos being virtually unbeatable, but I'm still not sure about Alves. I could see Story or possibly Ellenberger beating him via wrestling. I could maybe see Kampmann taking him down and outgrappling him to a decision as well. We'll see what happens this weekend. If Alves blows through Story then yeah, he's probably the third part of the trinity.
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    Senior Member Ludo's Avatar
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    Kampmann would get lit the hell up by Alves. He's too aggressive, too big to avoid that way, and uses leg kicks too well to set up his shots. He would press Kampmann alot more than Diego did and when Kampmann gets pushed into a corner he fights stupid, and sometimes gets knocked the fuck out. It would look alot like the Marquardt fight if he fought Alves.
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