Boxing play

[MMA_scientist]

Luke, got another question for you.

From my boxing commenter:

"You have Bika vs Brinkley this weekend coming. Bika is listed as 1.57, i was curious what your mates prediction would be for this. I have Bika to beat Jesse."

Thoughts?

[MMA_scientist]

I guess I will also pose my Klitcko question here:

Vitali is -5000 (not -500, I said -5000)
The other guy is +2000

Seems kind of worth it to toss $10 on the dog. Does this guy have any chance at all?

[Luke]

Luke, got another question for you.

From my boxing commenter:

"You have Bika vs Brinkley this weekend coming. Bika is listed as 1.57, i was curious what your mates prediction would be for this. I have Bika to beat Jesse."

Thoughts?


This fight was off because Brinkley pulled out with an injury(he had the flu and was unable to train)


::handshake::

[Luke]

I guess I will also pose my Klitcko question here:

Vitali is -5000 (not -500, I said -5000)
The other guy is +2000

Seems kind of worth it to toss $10 on the dog. Does this guy have any chance at all?


Simple answer is no he doesnt stand a chance. Albert Sosnowski is probably the biggest bum Vitali has fought in 10 years. I give him about a 1% chance of winning so +2000 has no value imo.

For me this would be like putting Sims up against Fedor

[zY|]

How is he 45-2 then?

[Luke]

How is he 45-2 then?


Because the guys he's fought are bums. This isnt MMA where there are only 100 pro fighters per weight class ,in boxing there's probably close to 1000 pros per weight class so theres ALOT of bums out there just looking for a paycheck

[zY|]

How is he 45-2 then?


Because the guys he's fought are bums. This isnt MMA where there are only 100 pro fighters per weight class ,in boxing there's probably close to 1000 pros per weight class so theres ALOT of bums out there just looking for a paycheck

LOL fair enough.

[Luke]

LOL fair enough.


I mean I think Roy Jones is a bum and he's ranked 10th in his weight class .Thats means there's 990 guys worse than him .Can you imagine how bad the 999th ranked guy is?

[SPX]

I mean I think Roy Jones is a bum and he's ranked 10th in his weight class .Thats means there's 990 guys worse than him .Can you imagine how bad the 999th ranked guy is?

So are you only NOT a bum if you're the champ? Or in the top 5? Or the top 9?

I really have some issues with your use of the word "bum." When I think bum, I think some down on his luck fighter, probably alcoholic, who hasn't won a fight in years and is of course nowhere near the top 10.

[Luke]

When I think bum, I think some down on his luck fighter, probably alcoholic, who hasn't won a fight in years and is of course nowhere near the top 10.


you've watched Rocky too many times ::handshake::

[SPX]

you've watched Rocky too many times ::handshake::

You fail to address the point.

How is a fighter who is in the top 10--especially when he comes from a pool of 1,000 fighters (your number)--and bum? That really makes no sense to me.

[zY|]

LOL fair enough.


I mean I think Roy Jones is a bum and he's ranked 10th in his weight class .Thats means there's 990 guys worse than him .Can you imagine how bad the 999th ranked guy is?

You can chill on that Roy Jones bum shit right now.

That guy is my hero.

</MIke Goldberg>

[Luke]

How is a fighter who is in the top 10--especially when he comes from a pool of 1,000 fighters (your number)--and bum? That really makes no sense to me.


LOL why do guys even care what I call fighters? Are you on their payroll? ::lmao::

[SPX]

LOL why do guys even care what I call fighters? Are you on their payroll? ::lmao::

I just think it's retarded. I also think that considering you used to fight yourself that it's a little odd for you to speak so disparagingly of another fighter's skills. I mean, if RJJ--or Brandon Vera, for that matter--are bums, then what about the guys who are fighting in your local MMA org? Super bums?

Personally, I just think that fighters who are willing to go into the cage or the ring deserve respect. If you have to call someone a "bum" or a "can" then at least reserve it for those who truly are, like maybe Blake Bowman or Andy Wang.

[Mr. IWS]

Andy Wang.

Pump your breaks man.

[Mr. IWS]

I know what Luke is saying. I throw out the "Bum" or "Can" label all the time.

[Luke]

I know what Luke is saying. I throw out the "Bum" or "Can" label all the time.


::handshake::

[zY|]

LOL why do guys even care what I call fighters? Are you on their payroll? ::lmao::

I just think it's retarded. I also think that considering you used to fight yourself that it's a little odd for you to speak so disparagingly of another fighter's skills. I mean, if RJJ--or Brandon Vera, for that matter--are bums, then what about the guys who are fighting in your local MMA org? Super bums?

Personally, I just think that fighters who are willing to go into the cage or the ring deserve respect. If you have to call someone a "bum" or a "can" then at least reserve it for those who truly are, like maybe Blake Bowman or Andy Wang.

Oh cmon. Half of the HW top10 is strikeforce fighters and you think they're all bums.

[Luke]

. I mean, if RJJ--or Brandon Vera, for that matter--are bums, then what about the guys who are fighting in your local MMA org? Super bums?

Personally, I just think that fighters who are willing to go into the cage or the ring deserve respect. If you have to call someone a "bum" or a "can" then at least reserve it for those who truly are, like maybe Blake Bowman or Andy Wang.


I dont consider local fighters or guys of small org bums because they are fighting to the best of their abilities .I usually use the term bum for people way past their primes that are still fighting or fighter not fighting up to their talent level.I mean jesus look at Vera ,the guy has all the talent in the world but is completely wasting it by being a pussy and a tard.To me thats a bum not the local guy who busts his ass and does the best he can with what he has

[SPX]

I know what Luke is saying. I throw out the "Bum" or "Can" label all the time.

I almost never use either term, and if I do then you know that I'm REALLY making a statement about how I feel about a fighter's abilities.

In my book, you have:

Top Guys/The Elite (Penn, GSP, Silva, Fedor)
High-Level Guys (Melendez, Edgar, Fitch, Alves, Marquardt, Mir)
Mid-Level Guys (Matt Hamill, Ross Pearson, Alan Belcher, Amir Sadollah)
Solid Fighters (guys like Shannon Gugerty who come into the UFC, maybe get a win or maybe not, but get cut after a few fights)
Bums/Cans (Blake Bowman, Andy Wang, that dude that Herschel Walker fought)

If I call a guy a bum or a can, then he just needs to find another profession.

[SPX]

Oh cmon. Half of the HW top10 is strikeforce fighters and you think they're all bums.

Apparently you've never really listened to what I've actually said about the Strikeforce HWs. I've said they are all good fighters. Even Werdum. Just not at the top of the food chain and not a threat to the top guys in the UFC's HW division.

And the reason I say that is because it's true.

[zY|]

Oh cmon. Half of the HW top10 is strikeforce fighters and you think they're all bums.

Apparently you've never really listened to what I've actually said about the Strikeforce HWs. I've said they are all good fighters. Even Werdum. Just not at the top of the food chain and not a threat to the top guys in the UFC's HW division.

And the reason I say that is because it's true.

True. The UFC HWs are better because they've proven it against...each other?

Oh and Dana said so.

[Mr. IWS]

I feel you X, but when Im in a conversation, Mid-level and down Ill call them guys cans. I know their really not, but when using the term, its usually in comparison to the high level and top guys.

Like for example, If Silva fights Belcher, when going through Silva's recent opponents, I would think a lot of people would say; "Silva has fought Hendo, Nate, Maia, and then a couple cans like Belcher, Leben etc.

And on a side note, How the fuck did Ross Pearson jump into your mind.?

[SPX]

True. The UFC HWs are better because they've proven it against...each other?

Oh and Dana said so.

Fedor is a given. Overeem could maybe do some serious damage.

But if you really think that Werdum, Bigfoot, AA, or Rogers would be a threat to the UFC HW titleholder then I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.

[SPX]

Like for example, If Silva fights Belcher, when going through Silva's recent opponents, I would think a lot of people would say; "Silva has fought Hendo, Nate, Maia, and then a couple cans like Belcher, Leben etc.

I'm really curious to see where Belcher's going to go from here. I think he's kind of a wildcard, because if you give him better fighters, he may just continue to beat people. There's no way to know without him being tested. (After all, some believe that he beat Akiyama.)


And on a side note, How the fuck did Ross Pearson jump into your mind.?

LOL

I was actually trying to think of Aaron Riley, who I consider to be a good, dependendable, mid-level guy at LW. And then I remembered that Pearson beat him. So Pearson took his spot on my mid-level list.

[Mr. IWS]

^^^^^^^^I think he beat Sexy too.

But he will get those Muy Tai shorts beat the fuck off him, if he comes within the same zip code as Silva.

[SPX]

But he will get those Muy Tai shorts beat the fuck off him, if he comes within the same zip code as Silva.

Yeah, but you drew a line between him and guys like Nate and Maia. Personally, I would like to see him fight either guy. I think it would be competitive either way and both matchups would be very interesting.

[Mr. IWS]

I like Belchers style, he attacks. Not good against Silva. That looks like a matrix style beat down waiting to happen. Im sure Dana would like to make that fight though, just to have Silva KO someone.

[SPX]

I mean jesus look at Vera ,the guy has all the talent in the world but is completely wasting it by being a pussy and a tard.To me thats a bum not the local guy who busts his ass and does the best he can with what he has

Honestly, I think that Vera's abilities have been overestimated ever since he knocked out Mir.

I think he's a solid and respectable fighter, hovering somewhere between mid and high-level. I don't hate because I think he's doing the best he can.

[SPX]

I like Belchers style, he attacks. Not good against Silva.

So what exactly IS a good style against Silva? Not attacking doesn't work. Attacking doesn't work.

I imagine beating Silva will take someone who attacks, but attacks BETTER than the man himself. Or perhaps a counter-puncher like Machida, but the problem there is that Silva won't attack unless you come at him first.

[MMA_scientist]

I mean jesus look at Vera ,the guy has all the talent in the world but is completely wasting it by being a pussy and a tard.To me thats a bum not the local guy who busts his ass and does the best he can with what he has

Honestly, I think that Vera's abilities have been overestimated ever since he knocked out Mir.

I think he's a solid and respectable fighter, hovering somewhere between mid and high-level. I don't hate because I think he's doing the best he can.

Just a side note, but someone told me that Vera's former trainer said that he will never live up to his potential because he is a massive stoner.

[SPX]

Just a side note, but someone told me that Vera's former trainer said that he will never live up to his potential because he is a massive stoner.

Interesting.

I have never heard that, but I wouldn't really doubt it.

[Mr. IWS]

So what exactly IS a good style against Silva?

Brock

[zY|]

I like Belchers style, he attacks. Not good against Silva.

So what exactly IS a good style against Silva? Not attacking doesn't work. Attacking doesn't work.

I imagine beating Silva will take someone who attacks, but attacks BETTER than the man himself. Or perhaps a counter-puncher like Machida, but the problem there is that Silva won't attack unless you come at him first.

Being a counter fighter doesn't necessarily mean you just stand there and wait. You can always come in close and force your opponent to react, then counter him.

As far as beating Silva, I think you're going to need someone who can outstrike him that he can't beat on the ground or in the clinch(unlikely anytime soon) or someone quick enough and well rounded enough to make him respect their striking so they can take him down and hurt him there and not get submitted. I think GSP can beat him this way(although size is an issue), and I think Shogun would school him on the mat and is skilled, quick, savvy and tough enough to get it there. As far as MWs go, I'm not seeing anyone right now that has a realistic shot.

That's my shitty opinion.

[SPX]

As far as MWs go, I'm not seeing anyone right now that has a realistic shot.


I'm not saying he WILL win, but I genuinely think that this man has a "realistic shot":


http://www.mma-brasil.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/vitor-belfort.gif

[zY|]

I guess he has as good a chance as anyone. Don't be surprised when things don't go his way and he gives up, though.

[Mr. IWS]

I think Vitor could do it at MW, thats about it. But I can see him flaking out and mailing it in.

At Light heavy, I think Shogun is probably the only guy. I dont think Machida could do it.

[SPX]

I guess he has as good a chance as anyone. Don't be surprised when things don't go his way and he gives up, though.

I wouldn't say "as good a chance as anyone" . . . I'd say "a better chance than most" solely because he has the speed and power to land just the right punch. Who else can we say that about that Silva's fought?

[zY|]

Sonnen can hold him down and beat him up. So could Henderson. Maia could've submitted him. Lots of guys have ways to beat him. I just don't think Vitors path is any more likely.

[poopoo333]

I honestly think GSP would beat Silva.

[MMA_scientist]

I honestly think GSP would beat Silva.

2nd

[Mr. IWS]

I honestly think GSP would beat Silva.

2nd

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b39/mexican_gurl21/srlsy.jpg

[MMA_scientist]

^^ totally. We haven't seen GSP's shot stuffed yet. We have seen Silva get taken down. So in this case, I think GSP's unstoppable force is greater than Silva's immoveable object.

[Mr. IWS]

Fair enough.

It goes without saying, we ALL want to see that one bad. I think if they win their next couple fights, it will happen. I think Silva wins, and would bet him, but I wouldnt be totally shocked if GSP won.

[Luke]

I honestly think GSP would beat Silva.

2nd


3rd

[Luke]

Since we are completely off topic again I have found it confirmed that the original point of this thread Bika vs Brinkley is off

[Mr. IWS]

Since we are completely off topic again I have found it confirmed that the original point of this thread Bika vs Brinkley is off

Huh?

::haptime::