Strikeforce December 17th

[poopoo333]

http://www.bestfightodds.com/fights/4124.png (http://www.bestfightodds.com)

[SPX]

I thought this fight wasn't actually going down. . .

[poopoo333]

I thought this fight wasn't actually going down. . .

It is.

[Luke]

Damn..........cant see Gil losing but -300..............sigh

[Vandelay]

Line guesses for this event? I expect future lw and lhw ufc champs to be underdogs in this one (fodor and OSP). Santos will probably be north of -1000, I believe evangelista will be a dog as well.

So Mousasi -160/OSP plus 140

Wilcox -250/Fodor plus 225

Santos -1200

Noons -200/Evangelista plus 170

[poopoo333]

OSP will be a good dog play

[SPX]

I hope Akano gives Cyborg a good fight.

[poopoo333]

WTF I need Bodog. OSP @+400?!?!?

http://www.bestfightodds.com/events/461.png (http://www.bestfightodds.com)

[poopoo333]

I just got Bodog. 5u on OSP @+400

[Thewisemann]

Lol at +400 that should get hammered

[poopoo333]

Too bad I won't be able to watch these fights. I am getting deported again this weekend until next Saturday.

Actually..SPX or Luke...text me SF results Saturday night after each fight.. I will be able to read the texts just not respond.

[MMA_scientist]

+400 is nice. I will be taking it at +375 if that holds

[Luke]

Too bad I won't be able to watch these fights. I am getting deported again this weekend until next Saturday.

Actually..SPX or Luke...text me SF results Saturday night after each fight.. I will be able to read the texts just not respond.


PM me your number .Somehow I lost it and its not in my phone anymore.

[Luke]

And BOL @ OSP being +400

[sbjj]

Took OSP for 1 unit(most I can bet online) @ +350.

[Luke]

when did bodog become http://www.bovada.lv/?

[poopoo333]

Last night I think...I got an email about it. ^^

I can't wait to win 20u this weekend.

[poopoo333]

Thoughts on Melendez/Masivdal? I think Masivdal is a live dog and Melendez has a little too much hype behind him. I guess it depends on Masivdal's T3D/grappling. He is a huge LW too.

KJ Noons/Billy Evangelista to go to decision is going to be a decent prop bet imo ...not sure who wins that though.

[MMA_scientist]

I think Melendez will be slightly behind in the striking, but that he will be able to get takedowns and is a better grappler. Melendez wins a decision.

[MMA_scientist]

OSP is already down to +325 and dropping. I lose yet again for not diversifying my online accounts.

[Vandelay]

Line guesses for this event? I expect future lw and lhw ufc champs to be underdogs in this one (fodor and OSP). Santos will probably be north of -1000, I believe evangelista will be a dog as well.

So Mousasi -160/OSP plus 140

Wilcox -250/Fodor plus 225

Santos -1200

Noons -200/Evangelista plus 170

Not too far off on the last 2. guess I overestimated how bookies viewed Mousasi. His line wasnt even this high against jardine

[poopoo333]

OSP is already down to +325 and dropping. I lose yet again for not diversifying my online accounts.

Yeah..hopefully I win this OSP bet and I will keep that $ in bodog for 2012 for my increased bankroll stuff. I will try and keep a good amount in bookmaker, 5 dimes, and bodog. Bodog has been breaking odds often

[MMA_scientist]

I think OSP has a very good shot here. I do think Mousasi SHOULD win, but he is bipolar, sometimes he looks like total crap. Just because of that reason, OSP is worth a bet. Also, Mousasi is trying to be a boxer or a kickboxer now, his head just seems like he has checked out of MMA.

[poopoo333]

OSP should be much bigger (right?) and probably has a better reach and will be able to wear Mousasi out against the cage and take him down and all that stuff. Jardine was taking Mousasi down fairly easy too IIRC. The only downside of OSP is that he will probably gas late in the fight and get in trouble

[MMA_scientist]

Yeah, I think OSP will be bigger, Mousasi is a MW that doesn't want to cut. I think Mousasi SHOULD be better standing though- but it depends which Mousasi shows up. I am all over OSP at that line, as I think he has a great shot here, mush better than the line indicates

[mike]

I dont know much about these strikeforce guys but I saw Justin Wilcox's fight vs JZ and thought he looked good. what do u guys think of him vs Fodor?

[SPX]

Wilcox will probably win via wrestling, but hard to call in my opinion. Fodor has done surprisingly well up to this point.

[mike]

3u on wilcox.

[Vandelay]

Wilcox is tempting at those odds, but Fodor is no joke. He beat an equally good striker and wrestler last time out.

[mike]

I just watched Fodor's last 2 fights. I think Wilcox keeps it on the feet and beats him up.

[Vandelay]

If wilcox tries to keep it on the feet, he will most likely lose. Fodor just pushes forward till he gets the clinch. Unless Wilcox circles and backpedals the whole fight.

[MMA_scientist]

I think Wilcox will go back to his wrestling here and win a decision

[mike]

If wilcox tries to keep it on the feet, he will most likely lose. Fodor just pushes forward till he gets the clinch. Unless Wilcox circles and backpedals the whole fight.
Fodor doesnt hit very hard and he just walk toward his opponent. Wilcox is pretty light on his feet, moving around instead of backing up. i think he will be the stronger puncher of the 2 also.

[Vandelay]

Nope, but he isnt a pillow puncher like bisping either. He beat a very good opponent in James Terry last time out, one that is probably a better striker than Wilcox is, by simply outworking him.

[SPX]

I really would not be surprised to see either guy win this fight. If Wilcox fights smart, he'll just take Caros down. He could also win a decision on the feet but I could see Caros pressuring him and wearing him down over three rounds.

Wilcox has looked great and beat the SHIT out of Rodrigo Damm. But Caros looked very impressive against Douglas and Terry as well.

[poopoo333]

I really would not be surprised to see either guy win this fight. If Wilcox fights smart, he'll just take Caros down

I don't think it will be that easy though...it's a tough fight to call.

[SPX]

Maybe not. I agree, tough to call. Should be a fun fight to watch.

[Ludo]

Full odds out:

http://www.bestfightodds.com/events/461.png (http://www.bestfightodds.com)

[Ludo]

I will bet the shit out of OSP if that line holds anything close to what it is now. I'm liking Noons' line as well. BOL at Cyborg opening at -800

[poopoo333]

I will bet the shit out of OSP if that line holds anything close to what it is now.

Where have you been?

[mike]

Nope, but he isnt a pillow puncher like bisping either. He beat a very good opponent in James Terry last time out, one that is probably a better striker than Wilcox is, by simply outworking him.
james terry is a better striker than wilcox? he didnt look that good striking with fodor. he just back up the whole time. i think fodor gonna eat alot of punches in this fight with wilcox stay at distance, jumps in for 1 or 2 hits then get out b4 getting countered. wilcox is faster than fodor both in his hands and footwork. fodor seem like a tough guy to stop though.

[Vandelay]

Have you seen terry before his fight with Fodor? its just what fodor does, makes people play his game and makes them look bad. Not easy to set up counters when someone is constantly looking to tie up and is doggedly walking you down.

[sbjj]

Hard fight to predict. Dave Herman could always gas out and get subbed. But Wilcox does not have the reach that Struve has.

Also not sure Fodor will lose the striking exchanges...he looked pretty sharp against Monson.

LOL @ Putin getting booed, that was funny. But Boy does Dave Herman gas quickly. Wilcox for sure has the cardio edge, but Struves subs are sick. Just ask Chuck Barry.

[mike]

Have you seen terry before his fight with Fodor? its just what fodor does, makes people play his game and makes them look bad. Not easy to set up counters when someone is constantly looking to tie up and is doggedly walking you down.

i have not seen any of james terrys fight besides the fodor fight. yeah fodor fights like chris leben with better defense minus the ko power. it will probably come down to wilcox being able to hurt fodor and stop his nonstop forward movement or will fodor catches up to wilcox and out work him. but even if wilcox slows down and let fodor get close to him, he can still takedown fodor. if fodor beats wilcox, ill be very impressed with him.

[sbjj]

Really starting to think Masvidal has a strong shot at the upset. Looking at all his recent opposition. the only fighter I see even remotely similar is Thompson. And Thompsons standup seemed to give Gil problems. And i think masvidal has MUCH better striking than Josh. In fact, one could make a case that Gil has had some pretty favorable match ups.

[Vandelay]

Fodor has an impressive guillotine that he uses to reverse position. And i would liken fodor's stalking to nick diaz. Stalks while throwing good, effective strikes and constantly looking to tie up so the other guy is worried about that.

[mike]

maybe he's more like Diego Sanchez; moving forward throwing arm punches and look to clinch hehehe

[poopoo333]

Really starting to think Masvidal has a strong shot at the upset. Looking at all his recent opposition. the only fighter I see even remotely similar is Thompson. And Thompsons standup seemed to give Gil problems. And i think masvidal has MUCH better striking than Josh. In fact, one could make a case that Gil has had some pretty favorable match ups.

Agreed... Melendez is overrated imo. He fought a close fight on the feet with Josh Thomson (who I don't think is too great), and sprawl and brawl'd that can Aoki. His best looking win to me was against Kawajiri. I don't get what warrants the discussions of him being a UFC LW champ.

[poopoo333]

Hard fight to predict. Dave Herman could always gas out and get subbed. But Wilcox does not have the reach that Struve has.

Also not sure Fodor will lose the striking exchanges...he looked pretty sharp against Monson.

LOL @ Putin getting booed, that was funny. But Boy does Dave Herman gas quickly. Wilcox for sure has the cardio edge, but Struves subs are sick. Just ask Chuck Barry.

Old people suck at trolling.

[mike]

Agreed... Melendez is overrated imo. He fought a close fight on the feet with Josh Thomson (who I don't think is too great), and sprawl and brawl'd that can Aoki. His best looking win to me was against Kawajiri. I don't get what warrants the discussions of him being a UFC LW champ.

I like Masvidal but too chicken to put any money on him. Hope he wins though. I love watching him fight.

[MMA_scientist]

Really starting to think Masvidal has a strong shot at the upset. Looking at all his recent opposition. the only fighter I see even remotely similar is Thompson. And Thompsons standup seemed to give Gil problems. And i think masvidal has MUCH better striking than Josh. In fact, one could make a case that Gil has had some pretty favorable match ups.

I think it is definitely closer than the line indicates. But Gil should have the takedown out. That is my concern with betting Masvidal. I expect Gil to come out looking to wow the UFC brass by coming out guns blazing. If he is getting tagged though, I am sure he will switch gears and try to wrestle his way to decision. But I do think Gil wants in the UFC badly, and he probably knows he has to be dominant in his wins... so he could come out and fight stupid. He has a Diaz-esque gas tank though, and I just don't think Masvidal can outgrapple him- he basically has to hope Gil fights dumb.

[trotterz]

http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f2/gegard-mousasi-says-he-would-cut-185-anderson-silva-video-1930399/

I know it will probably never happen, but damn I would love that fight to happen, it would be much better than GSP/Silva. It would be an awesome fight and I would have to favor Mousasi

[SPX]

Really starting to think Masvidal has a strong shot at the upset. Looking at all his recent opposition. the only fighter I see even remotely similar is Thompson. And Thompsons standup seemed to give Gil problems. And i think masvidal has MUCH better striking than Josh. In fact, one could make a case that Gil has had some pretty favorable match ups.

Luke and I were talking about this the other day.

I expect Gil to win, but his line is just too high for me to take. I think he should be -250 at the worst. I will be surprised if Mas wins, but not shocked.

[sbjj]

Yea, and a dude sitting @ -400 should basically be close to a lock.

[MMA_scientist]

agreed, definitely can't bet Gil. But I just don't think Masvidal can get it done.

Is it 3 or 5 rounds?

[sbjj]

5

[MMA_scientist]

I think that favors Gil personally. He is very hard to finish and he sets a high pace. He will wear Masvidal down eventually.

[SPX]

But I do think Gil wants in the UFC badly, and he probably knows he has to be dominant in his wins... so he could come out and fight stupid.

Yeah, I hear he has really be campaigning for it. But I also hear that the UFC said they're going to leave him where he is for now since it looks like SF is going to continue to exist for a while.

Other rumors I heard. . .

1. Sean Sherk might be fighting in February.
2. The UFC is going to get rid of the Gladiator intro in the near future.

[sbjj]

Yea, I think they are going to run SF kinda like WEC. Just focus on a few weight classes, and of course the women. I think they have a goldmine in the women. Gina has that movie coming out and I guess it is actually pretty good.

That Gladiator should have been gone long ago. Have it fight James Toney in a retirement match.

[SPX]

I'm cool with whatever as long as they keep the women. If the women lose Strikeforce, then they're really pretty much fucked. Bellator only has 115 and 125 and they really haven't been running a lot of women's fights lately so I don't think it's a priority for them. In Japan there's Jewel, but they pay peanuts over there.

Personally, I'd love it if someone were to start a major women's only MMA org. That would be awesome.

[Ludo]

I'm cool with whatever as long as they keep the women. If the women lose Strikeforce, then they're really pretty much fucked. Bellator only has 115 and 125 and they really haven't been running a lot of women's fights lately so I don't think it's a priority for them. In Japan there's Jewel, but they pay peanuts over there.

Personally, I'd love it if someone were to start a major women's only MMA org. That would be awesome.

It wouldn't get off the ground. Why do you think there are no womens boxing org's that we've ever heard of out there? I mean, there's foxy boxing but thats really only a truckstop kind of thing and not so much an organization as it is an idea.

[MMA_scientist]

^^ agreed. Lingerie football league has lasted longer and gotten more TV time than any real women's football league. People just don't want to watch women do things they suck at. They only like Gina because she is hot. Aside from that, what are they going to do, have the same 4 women do a round robin every 6 months?

What I don't understand is why you like it so much X? Are you just being contrarian because everyone knows it sucks? Or do you genuinely like it?

[SPX]

It wouldn't get off the ground. Why do you think there are no womens boxing org's that we've ever heard of out there? I mean, there's foxy boxing but thats really only a truckstop kind of thing and not so much an organization as it is an idea.

I think the MMA audience is fundamentally different from the boxing audience and that they're more open to new ideas and new directions for the sport.

But I do agree it would be a challenge. It would never get big like SF or even Bellator, but I feel like it could be profitable as long as whoever's running the ship is fiscally smart and a clever businessman, and I think it could find a home on a small cable network.


Aside from that, what are they going to do, have the same 4 women do a round robin every 6 months?

The more exposure women's MMA gets, the more girls are going to become aware of it and start training. And the more money that's available, the more talent the sport is going to attract. Look at Ronda Rousey. She's the only American to ever get an Olympic medal in Judo, and now she's in MMA. If an opportunity like SF wasn't out there, she probably would've chosen another career path.

It's just like the 125 lb. division. It will take some time to get it off the ground, but exposure + money will do it.


What I don't understand is why you like it so much X? Are you just being contrarian because everyone knows it sucks? Or do you genuinely like it?

While I've seen some sloppy cat fights, unlike you, I don't feel that the best female fighters are unskilled or "suck." Kaufman is a good boxer with strong wrestling. Not good for a woman . . . but simply good. Tate is a good wrestler. Coenen is a weak wrestler, but a good submission fighter, as is Fujii. Frausto is a solid kickboxer. Cyborg is a muthafuckin' BEAST. Amanda Nunes, from what I've seen, is a vicious striker. Rousey, despite my initial skepticism, looks to potentially be the best female grappler ever.

I enjoy watching it because I think it's a nice change of pace from men's MMA. With the women, there's a whole other vibe.

I also just believe that people deserve a chance to do what they love to do for a living. Maybe not a lot of people give a fuck about the WNBA, but the revenue stream is strong enough to keep the organization going year after year. You think those bitches have to work second jobs to pay the rent? Of course not. So I think it's just retarded for a woman to not have the same opportunity in MMA simply because she's a woman. Bottom line is that they deserve their niche. You may not want to watch, but I do and I know there are others like me.

[Mr. IWS]

I'm cool with whatever as long as they keep the women. If the women lose Strikeforce, then they're really pretty much fucked. Bellator only has 115 and 125 and they really haven't been running a lot of women's fights lately so I don't think it's a priority for them. In Japan there's Jewel, but they pay peanuts over there.

Personally, I'd love it if someone were to start a major women's only MMA org. That would be awesome.

http://i1191.photobucket.com/albums/z475/Coon_47/4TL/8yyulw.gif

[MMA_scientist]

While I've seen some sloppy cat fights, unlike you, I don't feel that the best female fighters are unskilled or "suck." Kaufman is a good boxer with strong wrestling. Not good for a woman . . . but simply good. Tate is a good wrestler. Coenen is a weak wrestler, but a good submission fighter, as is Fujii. Frausto is a solid kickboxer. Cyborg is a muthafuckin' BEAST. Amanda Nunes, from what I've seen, is a vicious striker. Rousey, despite my initial skepticism, looks to potentially be the best female grappler ever.

I enjoy watching it because I think it's a nice change of pace from men's MMA. With the women, there's a whole other vibe.

I also just believe that people deserve a chance to do what they love to do for a living. Maybe not a lot of people give a fuck about the WNBA, but the revenue stream is strong enough to keep the organization going year after year. You think those bitches have to work second jobs to pay the rent? Of course not. So I think it's just retarded for a woman to not have the same opportunity in MMA simply because she's a woman. Bottom line is that they deserve their niche. You may not want to watch, but I do and I know there are others like me.

You realize that the WBNA loses money and that the NBA subsidizes them right? I think the best it has ever done is break even- and there are only like 10 teams. There is not a "real" market for it- it is NBA charity.

You think Tate is a good wrestler, like she could beat Uriah Faber? They weigh the same. She is a good wrestler- for a girl.

Men don't have the same opportunities as women in some areas- simply because there is no demand. Just like a man can't really be a successful Hooter's girl... if he wants to try, he has to compete with the women. I don't see how this is any different.


I have no problem if you like it- we all have our own tastes. I like things that no one else likes too. I just wondered WHY you liked it.

[SPX]

You realize that the WBNA loses money and that the NBA subsidizes them right? I think the best it has ever done is break even- and there are only like 10 teams. There is not a "real" market for it- it is NBA charity.

Okay, fine. I confess I really don't know anything about the WNBA.


You think Tate is a good wrestler, like she could beat Uriah Faber? They weigh the same. She is a good wrestler- for a girl.

Well Brian Bowles couldn't outwrestle Faber, but he's respected as a decent wrestler.

And size doesn't equal strength. I think that if you took a solid--but not great--bantamweight wrestler and reduced his strength level to that of Tate then she'd give him a good run for his money.


Men don't have the same opportunities as women in some areas- simply because there is no demand. Just like a man can't really be a successful Hooter's girl... if he wants to try, he has to compete with the women. I don't see how this is any different.

You're not the boss of me.

[Luke]

http://i1191.photobucket.com/albums/z475/Coon_47/4TL/8yyulw.gif



BOL. Me either ::lmao::


Women,midgets,WEC,whatever...................if weighs below 170 lbs ::thumbdown::

[SPX]

Y'all are some dicks.

[SPX]

Hiroko Yamanaka



http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRwN6NmO5MAqK9vi1_cl7INdfB2AFoQf GfuKXxq6z7z67OslTdUeEoZNYXUUw




http://cdn2.cagepotato.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/HirokoYamanaka2.jpg




http://i41.tinypic.com/30vkmzb.jpg




http://i41.tinypic.com/20u8nlc.jpg




http://i39.tinypic.com/11hgfg8.jpg





http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7gAPCGjaCs

[sbjj]

Well, looks like Masvidal went into the fight with a broken right hand. Sure would explain alot. Sucks to be him. And sucks to be Gil knowing a guy with one hand did that well against him.

Gil is overrated. And his head will be popped sooner than later IMO.

[SPX]

Damn, that sucks. I guess he just didn't want to pull out of the fight?

[MMA_scientist]

Stupid. Why take that fight if you can't punch? I disagree with your assessment of Gil though, he wasn't too aggressive, but I don't think the fight was close at all. Gil dominated and won every rd with room to spare IMO.

[MMA_scientist]

I do agree that Gil would not be more than a fringe contender in the UFC though. He would have trouble with Miller/Bocek level talent IMO. He would not be able to beat Edgar/Bendo type guys.

[sbjj]

So you agree or disagree that Gil is overrated because in one post you say you disagree with me. But also say he would only be a fringe contender. When I say he is overrated i do not say he sucks. I basically mean he is not #1 LW, and most likely not top 5.

As for the fight not being close. Of course, you had a guy with 2 good hands against a guy with 1 good hand.

[MMA_scientist]

I meant i disagree that Masvidal "did well" against him. I do agree that he is overrated.

[sbjj]

I got ya. But I will tell you what, for a guy with one good hand I think he did pretty damn good. That is why I said "a guy with one hand did that well".

[SPX]

If the broken hand thing is true, then the fight basically told us nothing about either guy.

As for how well Gil would do in the UFC, I feel like it's really hard to say. I wouldn't be surprised to see him do as well as a lot of people expect, but I also wouldn't be surprised to see him be a bit disappointing.

[sbjj]

If the broken hand thing is true, then the fight basically told us nothing about either guy.

As for how well Gil would do in the UFC, I feel like it's really hard to say. I wouldn't be surprised to see him do as well as a lot of people expect, but I also wouldn't be surprised to see him be a bit disappointing.

I think it shoewd that Masvidal could bust Gil up with one hand. Now just imagine if the right cross was there right after the jab. Because usually if your jab is landing so is your right cross.

[MMA_scientist]

I just don't think he does anything better than the top guys. I suppose he could catch Edgar with a big shot, but his wrestling is not as good and his striking is not as good, so I don't know why anyone thinks he could beat him.

[sbjj]

Do not tell that to Frank Shamrock. Gil is the #1 LW in da world!

[SPX]

I just don't think he does anything better than the top guys. I suppose he could catch Edgar with a big shot, but his wrestling is not as good and his striking is not as good, so I don't know why anyone thinks he could beat him.

Are you just assuming his wrestling isn't any good? Because I can't remember when Gil has been outwrestled since maybe the first Thomson fight, and there's reason to think that he has improved a lot since then. After all, Thomson lost a wrestling match to Kawajiri, and Gil absolutely dominated that Jap motherfucker.

[SPX]

Cruz should be pissed.



Strikeforce ‘Melendez vs. Masvidal’ Disclosed Pay

Gilbert Melendez (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Gilbert-Melendez-5545): $150,000
(no win bonus)

Jorge Masvidal (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Jorge-Masvidal-7688): $23,000

Cristiane Santos (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Cristiane-Santos-14477): $66,000
(includes $33,000 win bonus)

Hiroko Yamanaka (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Hiroko-Yamanaka-20271): $8,000

Gegard Mousasi (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Gegard-Mousasi-7466): $150,000
(no win bonus)

Ovince St. Preux (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Ovince-St.-Preux-38842): $17,000

K.J. Noons (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/K.J.-Noons-6727): $65,000
(includes $30,000 win bonus)

Billy Evangelista (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Billy-Evangelista-14857): $20,000

Caros Fodor (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Caros-Fodor-45430): $20,000
(includes $10,000 win bonus)

Justin Wilcox (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Justin-Wilcox-16879): $12,000

Roger Bowling (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Roger-Bowling-23052): $ 14,000
(includes $7,000 win bonus)

Jerron Peoples (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Jerron-Peoples-81921) $ 2,000

Devin Cole (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Devin-Cole-13370): $12,000
(includes $6,000 win bonus)

Gabriel Salinas-Jones (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Gabriel-Salinas-Jones-65296): $3,000

Eddie Mendez (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Eddie-Mendez-37421): $6,000
(includes $3,000 win bonus)

Fernando Gonzalez (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Fernando-Gonzalez-8578): $3,000

Herman Terrado (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Herman-Terrado-29836): $6,000
(includes $3,000 win bonus)

Chris Brown (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Chris-Brown-52275): $3,000

[Mr. IWS]

Chris Brown (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Chris-Brown-52275): $3,000

http://www.picgifs.com/celebrities/c/chris-brown/celebrities-chris-brown-652703.jpg