Bellator 22

[edman5555]

Re: Bellator 22

Also,, it seems to me that Hornbuckles only chance is to knock him out standing...which could very well happen. However I think that if askren can get him down he can most likely hold him there for the entire round if he has to. That means he only has to get him down once or twice a round, depending on how frequently the ref likes to stand them up. His top control is very very active from what i have seen in his fights against Ryan Thomas as well.

[MMA_scientist]

Re: Bellator 22

^^ i remember reading about him startug bjj when he was still in college. So he proabbly started around the same time Hornbuckle did. Askren is a lot better grappler than Rosholt though- the wrestling is close, but Askren is incorporating guard passing and submissions into his game. That should make him more aware of the submissions as well.

I don't think Grove is a better grappler than Hornbuckle. Miller is though. Hornbuckle has 10 submission wins and was ranked in SD top 10 for a while. He is a better fighter than Grove and Miller IMO. But I just think Askren will have the tools to beat him on the ground, where this fight is going to take place, unless Askren walks into something shooting in.

[edman5555]

Re: Bellator 22

Yeah I didn't really have anything to back up the KG bjj assessment. I just remember him triangling Rosholt with those ridiculiously long legs when I had money on rosholt.

[AC88]

Re: Bellator 22

A lot of people had money on Rosholt for that one. Maybe even I did. Ugh

[MMA_scientist]

Re: Bellator 22

Also,, it seems to me that Hornbuckles only chance is to knock him out standing...which could very well happen. However I think that if askren can get him down he can most likely hold him there for the entire round if he has to. That means he only has to get him down once or twice a round, depending on how frequently the ref likes to stand them up. His top control is very very active from what i have seen in his fights against Ryan Thomas as well.

I agree, he basically has to get three takedowns (one in each round) and then avoid the triangle and upkicks. He likes to pass guard and he is impossible to hold down. Even if Hornbuckle sweeps him, Askren has a freak ability to just roll over (that is how he used to wrestle and also why he is not a godl medalist IMO- he would go to a precarious spot, then just flip over on top... but in freestyle wrestling, you cannot expose your back to the mat at all, it is not a good fit for his style of wrestling). I think he could be world champ in folkstyle, if there was such a thing.

[MMA_scientist]

Re: Bellator 22

A lot of people had money on Rosholt for that one. Maybe even I did. Ugh

I lost 5u on that fight. Grove has a surprising guard. He almost armbarred Almeida. Just, the rest of his grond game is not that solid.

[AC88]

Re: Bellator 22

Grove actually did have the armbar on tight and damaged his arm. Almedia talked about it in a post-fight interview. He just didn't tap though.

[Ludo]

Re: Bellator 22

Grove's length is the only thing keeping him alive in his MMA career right now. If he was 6'1" he'd have gotten smashed in his last 4 straight with relative ease. But because he has the build of a fucking praying mantis his striking looks better than it actually is, his submissions can compensate for the fact that his bottom game is pretty bad all because his limbs are longer than average.

[edman5555]

Re: Bellator 22

Also,, it seems to me that Hornbuckles only chance is to knock him out standing...which could very well happen. However I think that if askren can get him down he can most likely hold him there for the entire round if he has to. That means he only has to get him down once or twice a round, depending on how frequently the ref likes to stand them up. His top control is very very active from what i have seen in his fights against Ryan Thomas as well.

I agree, he basically has to get three takedowns (one in each round) and then avoid the triangle and upkicks. He likes to pass guard and he is impossible to hold down. Even if Hornbuckle sweeps him, Askren has a freak ability to just roll over (that is how he used to wrestle and also why he is not a godl medalist IMO- he would go to a precarious spot, then just flip over on top... but in freestyle wrestling, you cannot expose your back to the mat at all, it is not a good fit for his style of wrestling). I think he could be world champ in folkstyle, if there was such a thing.

Yeah I was going to say something about Askren Rolling over a lot. I noticed in the Ryan Thomas fight that sometimes Askren would get kinda rolled over or it would look like he was being put into a bad position but I don't think it is really as it appears. I think either it's A: he goes there on purpose because he is looking for a move/position and he doesn't care about being there because he knows he can get back easily. Or B:He'll go for crazy shit that might get him swept because he doesn't care if he is on his back because he knows he will get right back to top position easily. Or it's both A and B which I think may by the case.

[AC88]

Re: Bellator 22

Hornbuckle's mma experience is worth noting.

[MMA_scientist]

Re: Bellator 22

^^ agreed. Hornbuckle is a much better fighter. But given the fact that Askren would have to be suicidal to try to stand with him, and the fact that Hornbuckle doesn't try to stop takedowns...this is going to be a grappling match with hammerfists and upkicks.

[AC88]

Re: Bellator 22

Ooooh. Askren's line went from +115 to +125.

1U on Askren for now.

[sideloaded]

Re: Bellator 22

10u on Askren. No way he doesn't win.

[AC88]

Re: Bellator 22

1U on Askren officially because the line is closed. Betus sucks

[MMA_scientist]

Re: Bellator 22

10u on Askren. No way he doesn't win.

I think I have asked this before. How do you define a unit? That is big dog bet.