UFC 146

[poopoo333]

I think Cormier is the biggest gift of the year.

Or Jon Jones ITD -180

[edman5555]

I don't get why you think JDS is a gift. You don't think Reem can beat him? He at least has a solid chance. He is the K1 Grand Prix winner..

[Luke]

I don't get why you think JDS is a gift. You don't think Reem can beat him? He at least has a solid chance. He is the K1 Grand Prix winner..

So is Mark Hunt but I dont think he stands a chance against JDS either

[SPX]

I would be much more inclined to like JDS's line if he was closer to even.

[poopoo333]

So is Mark Hunt but I dont think he stands a chance against JDS either

I would probably go all in on Hunt over JDS. JDS can't knock out fat guys.

[edman5555]

As good as JDs is we have only seen him outstrike one good striker and that is Gilbert Yvel. I think Reem gives him a run for his money. What about his technique and Reems technique has you so convinced he wins?

[Ludo]

As good as JDs is we have only seen him outstrike one good striker and that is Gilbert Yvel.

And Cro Cop.

I think Reem gives him a run for his money. What about his technique and Reems technique has you so convinced he wins?

Overeems striking defense could be better when he's not slipping punches. He tends to try to use his hands to block incoming strikes rather than head movement, which works well in K-1 because of the big gloves, but won't work so well with 4oz gloves against someone with the precision JDS brings to the table. We haven't seen a whole lot of Overeem slipping punches like he was doing before he got so big in a while now. He did slip a flurry from Vitor back in pride after missing a flying knee, but that was about six years and 60lbs ago. We've seen Dos Santos go fifteen minutes with one punch killers and dish out way more than he takes, we haven't seen Overeem standing with anyone truly dangerous(aside from Rogers who really doesn't count) for very long in years.

[Luke]

The fact K-1 Werdum was out-striking him

[edman5555]

I think he was worried about over committing himself in the Werdum fight. In response to not having seen him with an elite striker: the K1 grand prix...he faced top guys there. His striking seems to hold up pretty damn well. Obv that is not an MMA fight but it still counts for demonstrating striking ability. JDs did beat Cro Cop though, that is a good win. Not great but pretty good.

[edman5555]

The fact is Overeem has outstruck better strikers than JDS has. IMO. If you count K1 that is. At least as far as we know. JDS could have fought some badasses in Brazil.

[Ludo]

I think he was worried about over committing himself in the Werdum fight. In response to not having seen him with an elite striker: the K1 grand prix...he faced top guys there. His striking seems to hold up pretty damn well. Obv that is not an MMA fight but it still counts for demonstrating striking ability. JDs did beat Cro Cop though, that is a good win. Not great but pretty good.

We've been over that time and again. His opponents in the grand prix weren't elite, at least not anything special by the time he got to them. He fought his own team mate to start, then two straight heavily injured opponents and didn't even have to face the favorite to win the whole thing.

[poopoo333]

This Ubereem vs JDS debate is going to be great for the next 2 months. I wonder if it will be crazier than Anderson Silva/Chael Sonnen debate from UFC 117 which made a 100 page thread?

[edman5555]

Overeem beat Peter Aerts the first time they fought in 2009...That is the same Peter Aerts that beat Semmy Schilt a year later. I do agree that his path to the Grand Prix title was easy in comparison to what it could have been but it is still no small feet. Overeem also beat Tyrone Spong. He is supposed to be very good although a bit smaller.

[Ludo]

Peter Aerts was 40 years old during the 2010 GP. He's been fighting for 26 years now, 24 at the time of the GP. That's a ton of mileage for even non contact sports. Schilt had gone three full rounds with Kyotaro and it still took everything Aerts had to beat him. He pretty much blew his wad against Semmy, which is why it only took 1:06 for Alistair to beat him. I'm not saying that guys don't end up being exhausted by the end every time, I'm just saying they don't always end up being 40 years old and exhausted after taking out the favorite to win the whole thing. Overeems only quality win for the grand prix that night was in fact Spong.

[edman5555]

" His only quality win" Spong is supposed to be very good. How many top guys do you have to beat to be good? BTW he beat Peter Aerts twice. The first time he beat Aerts it was not after Aerts had fought someone else so that point is somewhat moot. Aerts is one of the greatest kickboxers of all time and he is still very good. Aerts beating Semmy Schilt is evidence of that. It is pretty clear to me that Overeem has beat some of the best kickboxers alive.

Again, I am not saying JDS loses. He might go out there and drop Overeem in the first minute. I will say that I consider that far from guaranteed. JDS is definetly good but it is kinda hard to tell if he just looks good because he is fighting lower level strikers. How would JDS fair in a kickboxing match against a Top K1 guy?