2011 Off topic thread(basketball,movies,etc whatever)

[Svino]

^^^ Yeah, I remember you mentioning that story a few weeks ago.

He did, but he didn't mention the part about watching footage, which makes it funnier.

My memory of the earliest UFCs is extemely hazy, though. So I'm going back and checking them out. I might just roll all the way from the beginning to the present, or at least to about UFC 83 which is around when I started giving a fuck again.

I first heard about the UFCs from my friends, who ordered the UFC 4 ppv and got ripped off when it got Heidi-gamed ("Well, I guess that wrestler-dude won."). I didn't see any complete events until several years later, when I got totally hooked and watched them all through in order. Oddly enough, at the time I didn't get interested in the contemporary UFCs, because they seemed lame to me with all the safety rules. It was a few more years before I started watching those.

I still go back and look at old-school stuff occasionally. There are a lot of hidden gems in there. The announcing was so crazy it was a show in itself. I'd totally watch an mfc event or something announced by Jim Brown and Brian Kilmeade again. You also see people you recognize in the stands sometimes. I saw Josh Barnett in the crowd at one of the early shows.

(Speaking of people in the stands at early UFC events, is that avatar pic Michelle Krasnoo?)

[SPX]

Oddly enough, at the time I didn't get interested in the contemporary UFCs, because they seemed lame to me with all the safety rules. It was a few more years before I started watching those.

It's interesting to watch them again/for the first time. The clock ticks up instead of down. The announcers cheer a great knee to the head of a grounded opponent. No one gets stood up. And at least one competitor wore what appears to be a prototype of today's MMA gloves (Melton Bowen).

Today's stuff is at least very different in comparison. In the sense that modern MMA has far more skilled and better-conditioned fighters, today's sport is much better. But if you just want to see a good ol' fashioned beat down, the older stuff is where it's at.

Also, I think the style-vs-style element was interesting. One thing I will point out is that the early UFC competitors weren't all as one-dimensional as we make them out to be.

Keith Hackney actually successfully sprawled a few times against Royce.
Steve Jennum demonstrated both stand-up and ground skills.
Dave Benateu, despite being a wrestler/judoka, showed an awareness of needing to be able to punch too. Not only did he GnP his first two opponents, but he gave Severn a good run for his money, tagging him several times on the feet while using his own wrestling skills to stay standing.

The announcing was so crazy it was a show in itself.

No shit.

From what I remember Bill Wallace was on the team for, I think, UFC 2 or 3 and it was fucking hilarious. In fact, I think that's the one I'm going to hit up next.

(Speaking of people in the stands at early UFC events, is that avatar pic Michelle Krasnoo?)

It is. And considering she's an old-school sport karate girl, I'm fucking shocked that you know that. Since I've always had at least some sort of awareness of the traditional MA world since I was young, I have known of her for a while. I admit my predominant exposure has been due to her role in Kickboxer 4, though.

When I saw her the other night while watching UFC 4 I had an instant awareness that she should be my next avatar.

[MMA_scientist]

^^^ Yeah, I remember you mentioning that story a few weeks ago. I think it's a generational thing. I think that most males under 30 have at least a passing knowledge of modern MMA, or have seen something on TV/PPV at some point.

LOL, I am senile. I totally remember it now, but I forgot that I told you guys the story.

I think it generational, but also related to your level of male-ness. I watched UFC 2 on VHS probably in 1995 or 1996. I remember I lived in my first apartment so I had to be a freshman or sophmore in college. Of course, I then rented all other available UFCs and continued until about UFC 9 when I moved on with my life. Then I regained interest temporarily in like 2001, during the dark ages of the UFC, because I was training in an MMA club and several guys (including Karo and Manvel) came to train with us. I think I watched one or two events, then lost interest. Then the first PPV in the modern era that I got was Vitor vs. Tito in 2005 ( I think UFC 52) and I have seen virtually all of them since then.

[MMA_scientist]

The announcing was so crazy it was a show in itself. I'd totally watch an mfc event or something announced by Jim Brown and Brian Kilmeade again.

Rich G-Man Goins beats the shit out of Buffer. "Royce Gracie...Gracie." I dig how he does his own echo effect.

[Luke]

I think it was UFC 2. I thought it was UFC 1, but when I went back and re-watched it none of the fights seemed familiar.

I actually saw the first two UFC's right when they came out onto video,I was amazed this little guy who was beating everyone . My dad then bought the UFC that had the Royce-Shamrock rematch and he also bought the Severn -Shamrock rematch . After that I didnt see a UFC for about 10 years until I started watching it regularly around 2006

[zY|]

I went back and watched them all from 1 on at one point.

[Luke]

I went back and watched them all from 1 on at one point.

I've seen many of the fights from the 10 year gap I didnt watch UFC but most of them were well known fighters , I havent seen a lot of the lesser known fights/fighters

[Svino]

And at least one competitor wore what appears to be a prototype of today's MMA gloves (Melton Bowen).

I forgot about that! I was thinking Tank Abbott was the first to wear those, but Bowen was a couple UFCs earlier. All the other clothing (shoes, gis, singlets) was interesting too, as well as the fact that people could grab it. People were surprisingly slow to realize that not protecting your hands and wearing grabable clothing could get you in trouble.

Also, I think the style-vs-style element was interesting. One thing I will point out is that the early UFC competitors weren't all as one-dimensional as we make them out to be.

Yeah, I've long thought that biggest difference between the best fighters then and now has as much to do with athleticism and the amount of training. I also think it's interesting the extent to which modern knowledge about traditional style matchups has totally failed to sink into the mainstream. I bet most people, even guys that consider themselves slightly interested in martial arts (but don't watch MMA) would still say that a boxer would usually beat a wrestler.

[SPX]

I actually saw the first two UFC's right when they came out onto video,I was amazed this little guy who was beating everyone.

You know, I remembered Royce as always being way undersized, but except for his fight with Dan Severn, he really wasn't. Even Shamrock only had like 25 pounds on him.

People sometimes make it out like it was Frankie Edgar in there with those guys.

Also, I have a feeling that the drawing was rigged. There's a reason he got guys who only moderately outweighed him in the first rounds of the events, instead of getting guys who were significantly larger.

[Luke]

Just got this email :

NOTICE
Matchbook, the betting exchange of which you are a registered participant, is being sold effective February 28th 2011. The new owners of Matchbook have been informed by its legal advisors that accepting wagers from anyone located within the United States might constitute a violation of United States law. Accordingly, Matchbook will no longer accept a participant located in the United States, where wagering on a sporting event or any other event in which chance predominates might be a violation of law. As a result, if you are a registered participant located in the United States, you will not be able to access your account for the purposes of placing a wager effective immediately upon the transfer of ownership of Matchbook on February 28th 2011.
The accounts of all registered participants located in the United States will be closed effective February 28th 2011. The new owners of Matchbook will work with the affected participants to ensure that all funds remaining in the registered participants’ accounts as of February 28th 2011 will be returned to the registered participants located in the United States within 31 days from the aforesaid date.
Registered participants whose accounts will be closed effective February 28th 2011, will be sent, via email, detailed instructions as to the procedure required to receive the funds remaining in their respective accounts as of February 28th 2011. The new ownership will provide contact information for questions from registered participants whose accounts have been closed. Participant’s funds not claimed within the 31 days will be turned over to the Antigua Financial Services Resource Commission.
The new owners of Matchbook are in no way associated or affiliated with WSEX or the previous ownership of Matchbook prior to February 28th 2011.
The new owners and management look forward to heralding a new dawn in financial prudence and stability, while continuing to offer a world class betting exchange with improved global sports offerings. Matchbook intends to expand its operations into the European and Asian markets through encouraging a steady increase in event liquidity as well as expanding payment channels into these markets. Please stay tuned for further updates in the coming weeks".

The Financial Services Regulatory Commission, (FSRC) the agency responsible for overseeing the online gaming industry in Antigua and Barbuda has been advised of the transfer of ownership of Matchbook and has approved the transfer to the new ownership. The FSRC could be reached at www.antiguagaming.gov.ag .

This blows looks like I'll have to find a new book. I used matchbook more than any other book. Maybe I'll head back to bookmaker again

[SPX]

I forgot about that! I was thinking Tank Abbott was the first to wear those, but Bowen was a couple UFCs earlier.

I remembered the Bowen fight, but that thought that he had worn full on boxing gloves. However, that's not the case. They actually look a LOT like modern MMA gloves.

Yeah, I've long thought that biggest difference between the best fighters then and now has as much to do with athleticism and the amount of training.

I think that's definitely a factor. It's amazing how many of the earliest fighters were fat fucks. But I think some of the guys from the early days stand out, including Hackney, Jennum, Benateu, Pat Smith, and Kimo.

I also think it's interesting the extent to which modern knowledge about traditional style matchups has totally failed to sink into the mainstream. I bet most people, even guys that consider themselves slightly interested in martial arts (but don't watch MMA) would still say that a boxer would usually beat a wrestler.[/QUOTE]

[SPX]

This blows looks like I'll have to find a new book. I used matchbook more than any other book. Maybe I'll head back to bookmaker again

Damn, that's fucked up.

I really think you should have multiple accounts. At least two.

[Svino]

Also, I have a feeling that the drawing was rigged. There's a reason he got guys who only moderately outweighed him in the first rounds of the events, instead of getting guys who were significantly larger.

From Sherdog interviews with Keith Hackney:

The lottery bowl -- they bring it out and it’s going in slow motion,” Hackney says. “Apparently, there were some problems with it. They had Royce’s ball in the thing, and it’s like: What is this bulls--t? It’s barely moving, the ball lifts up, and he gets Ron van Clief [for his first opponent]. After that, the machine is working fantastic. I got Joe Son.”

To the Gracies' credit, they did always have him fight last in the first round. That's a disadvantage.

[Svino]

I think that's definitely a factor. It's amazing how many of the earliest fighters were fat fucks. But I think some of the guys from the early days stand out, including Hackney, Jennum, Benateu, Pat Smith, and Kimo.

Kimo's a good example, though. I think he had almost no training before UFC 3. He was just a big, tough, dude. And Gary Goodridge had some success even though his only serious background was in arm wrestling. (He had something like a couple months training in boxing and a couple months of Kuk-Sool-Won.)

[SPX]

To the Gracies' credit, they did always have him fight last in the first round. That's a disadvantage.

LOL

And I do remember running across that Hackney article. I suspect there may have been something to that. Gracie never really got matched up with the guys who were WAY bigger than him . . . guys who were so damn big that technique could potentially be nullified.